Complete brake failure while towing...

[ecostruction]

Was mobilizing some equipment yesterday with the Deuce and had a complete brake failure a few miles from my destination. I was towing an equipment trailer with my mini-excavator on it when it happened. I had a scout car with me and was able to make it to my destination via back roads in low range 1st/2nd.

What saved me was being in the right frame of mind. Regardless of your maintenance, understand that this is a very old and antiquated system. Even though you think everything is in order, things can happen. I was somewhat prepared. Not to fix, but to deal with the situation safely.

I'm not going to tell you what to do or how to do it or lecture on safety, etc. There are several ways to skin a cat. Have options everytime you head out.

I haven't checked out my problem just yet, but suspect it's a rusted line next to the air tanks. I was not in the mood to look after it happend. Just wanted to get it parked and head for home and a cold one.

Be safe!

Eco

 

[surewriting]

Whoo glad no one got hurt. Good luck with your repairs, and I hope it doesnt happen again.

 

[gimpyrobb]

That could have been BAD for you and your gear. Glad you made it safe.

 

[cattlerepairman]

It just proves that there is no such thing as paranoia when it comes to single circuit brakes. Going all out in checking, maintaining and repairing them is just common sense.

I replaced the parking brake shoes, parking brake cable and handle, adjusted as per TM and tested the function as an "emergency" brake.

Ahem....even empty, the effect of the parking brake applied is not very obvious at speed.

If you lose the service brake on the Deuce at speed, especially when loaded....good luck to you and I wish you plenty of straight, empty, level road ahead.

Even if your mind set is right, whatever action you take will need the vital seconds and empty road to implement it.

 

[Flyingvan911]

Don't mis-underestimate downshifting. It will help. A deuce is like an airplane. Have a plan for every situation.

 

[akonitony]

Guess I need to take some extra underwear along on my next recovery (5-ton loaded with 5 tons). That is if I'm still alive when the EUC clears. Day 51 and counting...

 

[velociT]

Don't mis-underestimate downshifting. It will help. A deuce is like an airplane. Have a plan for every situation.

This.

I was surprised at how effective downshifting is at slowing you down on flat ground.

 

[swbradley1]

Glad you and everyone around you is safe.

My Deuce brakes went out completely while sitting in the back yard.



steve

 

[tigger]

And have a crowbar within reach to pry the seat out of your a**.

 

[DieselBob]

And have a crowbar within reach to pry the seat out of your a**.

Man, talk about pucker factor. Glad to hear no damage done except to the nerves.

 

[WyoDeuce]

Glad to hear it worked out OK. My friend has a komatsu mini excavator and it weighs more than my deuce! 14,000#. That's a lot of weight for no brakes.

 

[RangerDave]

Glad you're safe Dittos!!! My brakes let go this winter as well - but it was during my pre-trip inspection!!! Needless to say, all of the parts to over haul the braking system that I had bought for a later date, turned out to be needed sooner rather than later!

 

[Westex]

You must have watched Duel. Steven Spielberg's first.

 

[cranetruck]

Glad you got it under control!
My very first MV was a Navy International Loadstar (with the HIAB) and one time driving it, there were suddenly no brakes what so ever. I was going downhill, but managed to use someones driveway as a "runaway" ramp.
We found one of the hydraulic brake lines rusted through, crimped it closed with a hammer, added brake fluid and headed home with brakes for the front wheels only. This truck had a lot of rust damage, presumably from sitting near the ocean during most of its life.
(Image shows the Loadstar as found in 1993)

 

[rwoods]

Just another example that you need to keep a cool head and go with the flow. This reminds me of while in college, the maintenance shop employed another student and me to take a decommissioned Navy International dumpster with a shop-built rig swinging from the back to tow a gift pickup truck from General Motors to Chattanooga. The gift pickup was down in SC where it had had an encounter with a bridge after the transport driver forgot to lower the ramps between his deliveries. Anyway, as some of you will remember I-75 used to have a gap in it between Atlanta and Chattanooga with a major intersection at the Atlanta end in a dip. I came humming up to this intersection at 65 mph with the pickup hanging from the back – the traffic light turns red – no brakes. All I could do was down shift, switch hands and lay on the air horn for a warning blast, switch back and grab the hand brake to scrub off as much speed as I could. Still went through the intersection at 40 plus mph with a very pale passenger. If it wasn’t for the good LORD, the air horn and a little experience, I probably would have taken out 3 or 4 cars. I drove more cautiously back to Chattanooga using the gears and the hand brake (don’t yell at me now, I was only 19).

 

[tennmogger]

OOhhh what a feeling when the petal does not work!

Do any Deuces have exhaust brakes? Or, do any mil veh's have exhaust brakes? Sure can be handy at such times.

Bob

Was mobilizing some equipment yesterday with the Deuce and had a complete brake failure a few miles from my destination. I was towing an equipment trailer with my mini-excavator on it when it happened. I had a scout car with me and was able to make it to my destination via back roads in low range 1st/2nd.

What saved me was being in the right frame of mind. Regardless of your maintenance, understand that this is a very old and antiquated system. Even though you think everything is in order, things can happen. I was somewhat prepared. Not to fix, but to deal with the situation safely.

I'm not going to tell you what to do or how to do it or lecture on safety, etc. There are several ways to skin a cat. Have options everytime you head out.

I haven't checked out my problem just yet, but suspect it's a rusted line next to the air tanks. I was not in the mood to look after it happend. Just wanted to get it parked and head for home and a cold one.

Be safe!

Eco

 

[Wolf.Dose]

Hallo there,
step by step: It is known, that single line brakes have a potential to fail as any mechanical system. Unfortunately: If they fail, they totally fail. No claim, no blame, it was the state of the art of technologie of the 1950's. And to change a air over hydraulic brake system to a two circuit system is rather difficult. There once have been valves available in the late 1970's in Europe, however, over and out.
The idea of using the propellent shaft brake as an emergency brake needs a good portion of - sorry - technical ignorance or these people are just blue eyed. It is a parking brake and not designed for any dynamic braking, just holding a laden truck on a 10 or 12% slope.
Engine brakes: Those trucks the US-Army bought in Germany of German origin must have an engine brake if over 9 metric tons GVW. Also smaller ones have an engine brake if they use the same engine family as the larger ones.
US air brake systems are not according our understanding of safety, they do not have a multi circuit protection valve. The air tanks are installed just in line. If on the supply side one tank leaks, all of them leak and loose air. If after the brake food valve the air is lost, at least some wheels brake as long as the air supply is larger than the loss. A little safer, however, below our standard.
To change this is a job of the government and the truck industry.
The MV owners are not to be blamed for these problems. All we can do is to keep our MV in the best technical level we can keep them, even with a lot of new parts and a lot of Dollars or Euro.
Wolf

 

[ecostruction]

Was rolling at about 23k lbs. Truck was empty and trailer with excavator was right about 10k. Engine brake in high was worthless. Over revved the engine, so I just put the clutch in and went for a ride. Only after my scout car cleared the road ahead and warned any oncoming traffic or pedestrians. Neither of which were present. What's weird is that my electric trailer brakes didn't work either once all the fluid was drained. I had some trailer brakes before which helped a bit, but once the fluid reservoir was empty, no more trailer brakes. Conceptually I can't picture in my head why this would be. The parking brake has ZERO affect on 23k lbs rolling at any speed. Engine braking was much better in low range. Like I said, once I had nothing to the pedal, I put it in 1st and 2nd low range for the last two miles. I literally could have walked faster. There was only one hairy moment when I was still in high range going about 25 down a grade toward two S turns. This is just after I lost all brakes. The engine wasn't holding me back and I saw the needle going past red-line, so my scout waved me on and I just put the clutch in and held on. Not as bad as i make it out to be, but was a little unnerving while it was happening. I may have hit 27 or so. But there was a hill on the other side to go up which just stopped me. Anyway, my only point with all this was.....

You just never know.......

be safe

Eco

 

[Capt.Marion]

Glad you made it out alright. Look forward to hearing the prognosis on your now non-existant brakes.

And, yeah, going downhill these diesels have zero engine braking unless you got a set of jakes or an exhaust brake.... one of these days I might convince myself that it'd be neat to put an exhaust brake on the deuce...

 

[stumps]

...
US air brake systems are not according our understanding of safety, they do not have a multi circuit protection valve. The air tanks are installed just in line. If on the supply side one tank leaks, all of them leak and loose air.

US air brakes have two tanks, a wet tank, and a dry tank. There is a check valve between the compressor and the wet tank, and another check valve between the wet tank and the dry tank. These valves positively prevent supply side leaks from bleeding off the pressure of the dry tank, which is the source of braking air pressure.

If a US air brake system loses system air pressure, the "spring pack" diaphragms will stop holding back the spring brakes, and the spring brakes will fully apply the brakes stopping the truck very rapidly. This spring brake doubles as a parking brake when the ICC valve is left in the open position. So, with a US air brake truck, the truck cannot move if there is insufficient air pressure in the braking system.

Bringing the conversation back to the deuce, its too has a wet tank, and a dry tank. There is a check valve between compressor and the wet tank, and between the wet tank and the dry tank. These valves prevent a supply side leak from bleeding the pressure off of the dry tank.

-Chuck